@redweasel
If you had said “yes it is possible for a lot of people to sympathize with delta vee, even if she’s a parent who doesn’t want her child,” and then continued with an extended argument to that claim, then I would have easily accepted that. Because that is how an argument is formed. You make a claim, and then you elaborate and provide for the claim. Then, if I disagreed, I would do the same; make a counter-claim, and then back it up with my reasoning. That’s literally how people debate. “yes it is possible for a lot of people to sympathize with delta vee, even if she’s a parent who doesn’t want her child,” would have honestly been the best response, because then you have a clear focus on the point you’re making, and you have plenty of room to back your statement up with your argument.
What you did instead was take an aggressive and hostile stance and make a statement that lacked any backup or . You simply rephrased what I said into an accusatory barb, and threw it back at me - all the while implying a sentiment that you and I both know I did not intend or express to begin with. That was not a counter-argument; that was an angry accusation. What do you expect me to do with “so, those of us who are parents, who don’t want their kid, couldn’t possibly sympathize with her?” There is no room to go from there. There isn’t an opportunity to discuss your point, because your point is just repeating what I said but manipulating and twisting it to imply something completely different from what I said. It comes off as incredibly hostile, as all accusations do. There is no room to initiate debate, because the only possible response is either “yes, that is what I meant” or “no, that is not what I meant” - and then I restate my argument and hope you respond with something different.
if I had just said “yes it is possible for a lot of people to sympathize with delta vee, even if she’s a parent who doesn’t want her child,” you’d be like “no it isn’t!” then I’m like “ya huh!” and you’re like “nuh uh!” and then the whole argument devolves into furious wailing and hoofy kicks.
What do you think we’re doing right now?
edit: And if any mods are watching this unfold, Redweasel and I are not fighting. We’re just talking about the nature of arguments and their structure. I’m not angry with them, and I’m sure they’re not too ticked off with me. I went over my response and did my best to take out the parts where I was being an asshole before I posted it, okay?
when I say “so, those of us who are parents, who don’t want their kid, couldn’t possibly sympathize with her?” it’s attempting to my argument by disproving the contrapositive, i.e. showing how the original claim leads to absurd conclusions. or maybe you’re right, and you can show me the faulty reasoning of my attempt to dispute it. if I had just said “yes it is possible for a lot of people to sympathize with delta vee, even if she’s a parent who doesn’t want her child,” you’d be like “no it isn’t!” then I’m like “ya huh!” and you’re like “nuh uh!” and then the whole argument devolves into furious wailing and hoofy kicks. when I want to disagree with someone, I like to try to give some reason for it, rather than just saying “no you’re wrong” and expecting them to just accept it.
as for meanlucario, I think we’re already at the point of hoofy kicks, so it’s all in good fun ♥
all I’m saying is it’s possible for a lot of people to sympathize with delta vee, even if she’s a parent who doesn’t want her child.
Then you should have said simply that from the very start. I am having a difficult time finding myself interested in debate with you because you immediately began throwing accusations around and decided - through no provocation but your own - that we were trying to say that people who put their children up for adoption are demented. Not a single mention of putting one’s child up for adoption was made, and you were the one who escalated things and brought the word “demented” into the fray. Calm discussion will clearly be impossible.
also this comic is a joke, so I don’t think delta vee really told apogee she didn’t want to receive her as a valentines day gift (again).
This is true. Still, character debate is interesting to me… but I suppose that discussion about a character’s… well, character is rather a moot point if it’s a joke comic that doesn’t occur in canon. Oh well.
@Communist Starlight
say “ur mom” and I might have to hit you with a rolled up newspaper.
@redweasel
That’s all true. I’m not sure why you’re arguing that you’re not mentally disturbed for not wanting a child, but you’re right; not wanting a child doesn’t mean you’re mentally disturbed. I don’t even know why you jumped into the discussion to argue about who is and is not mentally disturbed, because literally nobody said they were or hinted that they are. You brought that in all on your own.
I’m just saying it’s possible for someone to be a parent, and not want their child. it happens. sometimes just for an afternoon, sometimes for a particularly unpleasant family vacation, and sometimes they just don’t want their child at all. he said they had bigger issues, which is a kind way of calling someone insane or traumatized, but I don’t think that is the case. some women even have children as surrogate mothers, so they are parents for someone else’s sake, not because they want a child themselves, and there’s no reason to assume they’re mentally disturbed in some way for doing so.
so what, anyone who gives their child up for adoption is demented?
What the fuck? Do not put words in my mouth. I never said or even implied that - and neither did he. Don’t make up things just so that you can be angry about them. If you can’t remain civilized and hold a calm discussion, then kindly do not respond to me in the future.
@Mister Cliff
I think some people just really like flawed characters…
if they feel like they see too many characters lacking flaws, ie marry sues, then when they find a character with flaws, it’s like they are all “oh thank God she’s not perfect.”
Legit question here. Was the original intent of this series to make reader sympathetic towards Delta and dislike Jet? Because there’s nothing sympathetic about a parent openly itting to their kid that they don’t want them.
Edited
If you had said “yes it is possible for a lot of people to sympathize with delta vee, even if she’s a parent who doesn’t want her child,” and then continued with an extended argument to that claim, then I would have easily accepted that. Because that is how an argument is formed. You make a claim, and then you elaborate and provide for the claim. Then, if I disagreed, I would do the same; make a counter-claim, and then back it up with my reasoning. That’s literally how people debate. “yes it is possible for a lot of people to sympathize with delta vee, even if she’s a parent who doesn’t want her child,” would have honestly been the best response, because then you have a clear focus on the point you’re making, and you have plenty of room to back your statement up with your argument.
What you did instead was take an aggressive and hostile stance and make a statement that lacked any backup or . You simply rephrased what I said into an accusatory barb, and threw it back at me - all the while implying a sentiment that you and I both know I did not intend or express to begin with. That was not a counter-argument; that was an angry accusation. What do you expect me to do with “so, those of us who are parents, who don’t want their kid, couldn’t possibly sympathize with her?” There is no room to go from there. There isn’t an opportunity to discuss your point, because your point is just repeating what I said but manipulating and twisting it to imply something completely different from what I said. It comes off as incredibly hostile, as all accusations do. There is no room to initiate debate, because the only possible response is either “yes, that is what I meant” or “no, that is not what I meant” - and then I restate my argument and hope you respond with something different.
What do you think we’re doing right now?
edit: And if any mods are watching this unfold, Redweasel and I are not fighting. We’re just talking about the nature of arguments and their structure. I’m not angry with them, and I’m sure they’re not too ticked off with me. I went over my response and did my best to take out the parts where I was being an asshole before I posted it, okay?
Edited because: saying hello to the mods
when I say “so, those of us who are parents, who don’t want their kid, couldn’t possibly sympathize with her?” it’s attempting to my argument by disproving the contrapositive, i.e. showing how the original claim leads to absurd conclusions. or maybe you’re right, and you can show me the faulty reasoning of my attempt to dispute it. if I had just said “yes it is possible for a lot of people to sympathize with delta vee, even if she’s a parent who doesn’t want her child,” you’d be like “no it isn’t!” then I’m like “ya huh!” and you’re like “nuh uh!” and then the whole argument devolves into furious wailing and hoofy kicks. when I want to disagree with someone, I like to try to give some reason for it, rather than just saying “no you’re wrong” and expecting them to just accept it.
as for meanlucario, I think we’re already at the point of hoofy kicks, so it’s all in good fun ♥
For your information I was going to say “Me mum” but you know what
Then you should have said simply that from the very start. I am having a difficult time finding myself interested in debate with you because you immediately began throwing accusations around and decided - through no provocation but your own - that we were trying to say that people who put their children up for adoption are demented. Not a single mention of putting one’s child up for adoption was made, and you were the one who escalated things and brought the word “demented” into the fray. Calm discussion will clearly be impossible.
This is true. Still, character debate is interesting to me… but I suppose that discussion about a character’s… well, character is rather a moot point if it’s a joke comic that doesn’t occur in canon. Oh well.
You monster.
Edited
all I’m saying is it’s possible for a lot of people to sympathize with delta vee, even if she’s a parent who doesn’t want her child.
also this comic is a joke, so I don’t think delta vee really told apogee she didn’t want to receive her as a valentines day gift (again).
@Communist Starlight
say “ur mom” and I might have to hit you with a rolled up newspaper.
Edited
Now, not to point fingers, but I know someone.
That’s all true. I’m not sure why you’re arguing that you’re not mentally disturbed for not wanting a child, but you’re right; not wanting a child doesn’t mean you’re mentally disturbed. I don’t even know why you jumped into the discussion to argue about who is and is not mentally disturbed, because literally nobody said they were or hinted that they are. You brought that in all on your own.
Edited
I’m just saying it’s possible for someone to be a parent, and not want their child. it happens. sometimes just for an afternoon, sometimes for a particularly unpleasant family vacation, and sometimes they just don’t want their child at all. he said they had bigger issues, which is a kind way of calling someone insane or traumatized, but I don’t think that is the case. some women even have children as surrogate mothers, so they are parents for someone else’s sake, not because they want a child themselves, and there’s no reason to assume they’re mentally disturbed in some way for doing so.
What the fuck? Do not put words in my mouth. I never said or even implied that - and neither did he. Don’t make up things just so that you can be angry about them. If you can’t remain civilized and hold a calm discussion, then kindly do not respond to me in the future.
Edited
so what, anyone who gives their child up for adoption is demented? that’s pronatalism at its worst.
nevertheless, it does mean there is something sympathetic about her, even if only to people with “bigger issues.”
That’s why they’re re-doing the comic to try to make it that way.
@redweasel
I think you have much bigger issues if that’s the case.
so, those of us who are parents, who don’t want their kid, couldn’t possibly sympathize with her?
I think some people just really like flawed characters…
if they feel like they see too many characters lacking flaws, ie marry sues, then when they find a character with flaws, it’s like they are all “oh thank God she’s not perfect.”
Best. Comeback. Ever.
Even Jet Stream fell for it!
It’s on your head xD .
Depends if you find the other shoe.
Okay, Shoe, calm down xD .
Reeeeee
[Little to no fanfare]
Oh noes
That voice really does fit her like a glove, doesn’t it?
I wonder how good Apogee is at chess.